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Re: [CORE-Discussion] Stress

Comments (0) | Friday, July 3, 2015

Agreed Paschen. Used to make Dorsals years ago until we realized the the only thing the mesh in the wing did was keep the fin from binging around the room after being Bruce's off. Hardly ever do them any more, people need the lateral movement, and the lateral wear facets we see on initial exam tell us a big part of the story.

Sent from my iPhone

On Jul 2, 2015, at 1:42 PM, MarkPaschen <drmarkpaschen@gmail.com> wrote:

I would have to disagree that daytime Bruxing patterns are unrelated to nighttime patterns.  Sleep appliances with dorsal fins tend to break due to lateral bruxers, not poor lab work. Also, I am very careful when titrating protrusive bruxers, due to having sore digastrics which get very sore if titrated too quickly, not to mention very sore lower incisors. I always test for the Bruxing pattern on my patients before deciding on which appliance will work the best.   Paschen

Sent from my iPhone

On Jul 2, 2015, at 2:22 PM, 'Jeff Rouse' via CORE Dentistry Discussion <core-dentistry-discussion@googlegroups.com> wrote:

I have been monitoring diurnal patterns since 2008. We have found three common positions during the day. Protrusive is the most common. Probably related to stress reduction or airway improvement or both. Bennett clench- clenching in MIP. Some people, mostly women, have a significant (>1/5mm) side shift. You see the damage on the distal half of mandibular second molars. Last, lateral daytime bruxer. This is the person that moves around on their teeth all day long. Very damaging and hard to break of the habit. The three triggering mechanism appear to be stress or anticipated stress, airway/exercise, sympathetic activity (this is caused by the 24 hr rise in catecholamines from a fragmented nights sleep).

Glaros and others have told us from the early 1980's that daytime activity is totally unrelated to the nighttime variety. The pattern of movement, triggering mechanism...everything is different.

Just a wording issue...sleep is not causing bruxism. Airway is...


Jeff Rouse


-----Original Message-----
From: Curt Ringhofer <curtringhofer@gmail.com>
To: core-dentistry-discussion <core-dentistry-discussion@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Thu, Jul 2, 2015 1:55 pm
Subject: Re: [CORE-Discussion] Stress

I agree sleep arousals do result in bruxism.  Although, the question I have is from my own personal observations on myself.  While many (including my wife) would say then these are not normal observations, here is my question.  If clenching and bruxing only happens during an arousal, why do I catch myself clenching, and at times grinding when I am involved with a difficult dental appointment.  Just yesterday I was working on a case in which the appointment lasted about 3 1/2 hours.  During that time I had to remind myself to stop clenching at least a half dozen times.  Today I can feel the soreness in the muscles as well as my teeth.  I do not have sleep apnea and practice the buteyko technique on most nights, and I do wake up at times clenching my teeth when I have a lot on my mind.
 
I would have to agree with Steve (Hey Steve here is our common thread) that it may be more than just sleep that is causing clenching. 
 
This is truly a question.  How is that explained?
 
Curt 
 

On Thursday, July 2, 2015 at 12:28:42 PM UTC-5, ssimonettidds wrote:
A "stressful" day does not cause bruxism...the person may indeed have dysautonomia caused by improper facial development and this causes greater cortisol release which is what "stress" really is... The "stress" is endogenous and not caused by a bad day... It's caused by disordered breathing which creates the reflex of bruxism to enlarge the airway....
S Simonetti

Sent from my iPhone

On Jul 2, 2015, at 1:01 PM, 'Jeff Rouse' via CORE Dentistry Discussion < core-dentist...@googlegroups.com> wrote:

Steve:
I might have access to 1000 studies with bruxism recorded and the ability to look at apnea, rera and IFL. Will hopefully lead to move info on triggers for bruxism. The guy with the data said he sees most of it related to airway (he has not looked at IFL, only rera/apnea so that might explain the last part) but I also agree that something like a reflux event may trigger bruxism. The key being that it is a protective reflex when the ANS is active. Maybe we could all agree that: (1) Lavigne set the standard on sleep bruxism without a complete evaluation of the inspiratory triggers that could elicit a protective reaction. If your sleep lab only records apnea and hyponea, you might miss somethings. (2) Bruxism is not causally related to respiration. Maybe we could say...bruxism is causally related to protecting the body.

The bruxism data related to asleep bruxing and stress is either self report which a recent post on the blog showed is extremely unreliable (confirming 30 years of information) or was done with an EMG recorder that didn't measure if the patient was asleep. Stress and bruxism absolutely are linked but the patient is awake not asleep. My memory of a PSG study on stress and bruxism showed 8 of 100 times that the stressful day could be linked to asleep bruxism. Random chance...


Jeff Rouse


-----Original Message-----
From: Steven D Bender DDS <st...@benderdds.com>
To: core-dentistry-discussion <core-dentist...@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Thu, Jul 2, 2015 10:25 am
Subject: Re: [CORE-Discussion] Stress

The mis information produced by the ADA is an issue the AAOP has attempted to address on several occasions. Im not sure where they get their "experts".
As an aside, i dont think we can say all bruxism is airway related. There are probably numerous factors, stress being one.
Steve 

Sent from my iPhone

On Jul 2, 2015, at 9:57 AM, 'Mickey Harrison' via CORE Dentistry Discussion < core-dentist...@googlegroups.com> wrote:

Tom is spot on, however the ADA does miss the boat in recognizing this. Their ship has sailed as far as being a leader in sleep/airway dentistry.
 
Mickey C. Harrison, D.D.S.
TheMetzCenter.com
Cell:614.806.0301

Breathe better, sleep better, live better!


From: Brian T Fick <brian...@me.com>
To: "core-dentist...@googlegroups.com" <core-dentist...@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, July 2, 2015 10:27 AM
Subject: Re: [CORE-Discussion] Stress

Tom

Well said....
I was looking at "stress" more superficially... but I get your point and the link you make vis-a-vie the cortisol levels.


Thanks for taking me deeper.



Brian T Fick DDS
First Choice Dental Group
Partner / TMD Facial Pain 
621 South Park St.
Madison Wi. 
53715
608.251.3535 O
608.698.7594 C



On Jul 2, 2015, at 9:00 AM, Tom Colquitt < tcas...@gmail.com> wrote:

Looking at the big picture of stress--  are we talking about getting  divorce, getting  call from the IRS,losing our job, just watching the news.... all causes of exogenous stress?

Or of lack of ans coherence/homeostsis by endogenous stress related to inefficient breathing?  Hans Selye identified stress as a common factor in disease processes by discovering through bloodwork that the common denominator in chronic disease processes was the release of cortisol.  Cortisol is a stress hormone tht results in packing on belly fat despite the diet.  Hence part of the problem resulting in the high percentage of OSA patients who are obese and vice versa.  And in my opinion, one of the reasons obese patients with OSA, for whom we know every 10 pounds lost results in a diminution of the AHI, even though they may be managed 4 to 8 hours a night with CPAP or oral appliances...  STILL can't manage to lose the weight due to the other 16-20 hours a day they continue to release cortisol due to their dysfunctional breathing.  They clench and brux to keep their airways open due to the release of catecholamines when NONE should be released and continue to release cortisol with its damaging sequelae.

So, yes, in the big picture, bruxism is related to stress.

t. colquitt


On Thu, Jul 2, 2015 at 8:27 AM, Brian T Fick <brian...@me.com> wrote:
Doesn't the ADA keep up on current research? Aren't we long past this idea of bruxism being caused by stress!

The below explanation seems like a vast vast oversimplification

Correct?

From the ADA.

WJXT-TV Jacksonville, FL (7/2) reports that University of Florida researchers have created "a smart mouth guard equipped with sensors that allow it to detect" if a patient is grinding their teeth and relay information about the grinding to a dentist. Lead researcher and associate professor Yong-Kyu "YK" Yoon "said he came up with the idea about five years ago when he was developing a set of dentures that alert the dentist to an improper fit even if the patient doesn't complain about it." Fellow researcher and associate professor at the University of Florida Restorative Dental Sciences Department Fong Wong "said at least 20 percent of the U.S. population – about 30 million people – suffer from bruxism, which frequently is caused by stress and can lead to damaged teeth, headaches, insomnia, and a sore jaw.







Brian T Fick DDS
First Choice Dental Group
Partner / TMD Facial Pain 
621 South Park St.
Madison Wi. 
53715
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Re: [CORE-Discussion] Stress

Comments (0) |

��

Sent from my iPhone

On Jul 2, 2015, at 1:07 PM, Tom Colquitt <tcasoulet@gmail.com> wrote:

Repeat after Scott:  it's breathing-disordered sleep.  it's breathing-disordered sleep.

On Thu, Jul 2, 2015 at 2:23 PM, 'Scott' via CORE Dentistry Discussion <core-dentistry-discussion@googlegroups.com> wrote:
Curt, when a person has arousals during the night, the circulating cortisol lingers into the day.  This continues the dysautonomia into the day... Just because a person is awake does not mean they have perfect breathing... On the contrary... An untreated person who has disordered breathing will have respiratory flow limitations During the day since the underlying cause is still there.... This can create daytime bruxism as the body continues to find ways to open the airway a little bit more... This does not even consider they may be mouth breathing, have shallow breaths and have poor coherence during the day as well which propagates the dysautonomia and continued cortisol release... This will eventually lead to adrenal burnout....
That is why I never say SLEEP disordered breathing because that only tells half the story....
SSimonetti

Sent from my iPhone

On Jul 2, 2015, at 2:55 PM, Curt Ringhofer <curtringhofer@gmail.com> wrote:

I agree sleep arousals do result in bruxism.  Although, the question I have is from my own personal observations on myself.  While many (including my wife) would say then these are not normal observations, here is my question.  If clenching and bruxing only happens during an arousal, why do I catch myself clenching, and at times grinding when I am involved with a difficult dental appointment.  Just yesterday I was working on a case in which the appointment lasted about 3 1/2 hours.  During that time I had to remind myself to stop clenching at least a half dozen times.  Today I can feel the soreness in the muscles as well as my teeth.  I do not have sleep apnea and practice the buteyko technique on most nights, and I do wake up at times clenching my teeth when I have a lot on my mind.
 
I would have to agree with Steve (Hey Steve here is our common thread) that it may be more than just sleep that is causing clenching. 
 
This is truly a question.  How is that explained?
 
Curt 
 

On Thursday, July 2, 2015 at 12:28:42 PM UTC-5, ssimonettidds wrote:
A "stressful" day does not cause bruxism...the person may indeed have dysautonomia caused by improper facial development and this causes greater cortisol release which is what "stress" really is... The "stress" is endogenous and not caused by a bad day... It's caused by disordered breathing which creates the reflex of bruxism to enlarge the airway....
S Simonetti

Sent from my iPhone

On Jul 2, 2015, at 1:01 PM, 'Jeff Rouse' via CORE Dentistry Discussion <core-dentist...@googlegroups.com> wrote:

Steve:
I might have access to 1000 studies with bruxism recorded and the ability to look at apnea, rera and IFL. Will hopefully lead to move info on triggers for bruxism. The guy with the data said he sees most of it related to airway (he has not looked at IFL, only rera/apnea so that might explain the last part) but I also agree that something like a reflux event may trigger bruxism. The key being that it is a protective reflex when the ANS is active. Maybe we could all agree that: (1) Lavigne set the standard on sleep bruxism without a complete evaluation of the inspiratory triggers that could elicit a protective reaction. If your sleep lab only records apnea and hyponea, you might miss somethings. (2) Bruxism is not causally related to respiration. Maybe we could say...bruxism is causally related to protecting the body.

The bruxism data related to asleep bruxing and stress is either self report which a recent post on the blog showed is extremely unreliable (confirming 30 years of information) or was done with an EMG recorder that didn't measure if the patient was asleep. Stress and bruxism absolutely are linked but the patient is awake not asleep. My memory of a PSG study on stress and bruxism showed 8 of 100 times that the stressful day could be linked to asleep bruxism. Random chance...


Jeff Rouse


-----Original Message-----
From: Steven D Bender DDS <st...@benderdds.com>
To: core-dentistry-discussion <core-dentist...@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Thu, Jul 2, 2015 10:25 am
Subject: Re: [CORE-Discussion] Stress

The mis information produced by the ADA is an issue the AAOP has attempted to address on several occasions. Im not sure where they get their "experts".
As an aside, i dont think we can say all bruxism is airway related. There are probably numerous factors, stress being one.
Steve 

Sent from my iPhone

On Jul 2, 2015, at 9:57 AM, 'Mickey Harrison' via CORE Dentistry Discussion < core-dentist...@googlegroups.com> wrote:

Tom is spot on, however the ADA does miss the boat in recognizing this. Their ship has sailed as far as being a leader in sleep/airway dentistry.
 
Mickey C. Harrison, D.D.S.
TheMetzCenter.com
Cell:614.806.0301

Breathe better, sleep better, live better!


From: Brian T Fick <brian...@me.com>
To: "core-dentist...@googlegroups.com" <core-dentist...@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, July 2, 2015 10:27 AM
Subject: Re: [CORE-Discussion] Stress

Tom

Well said....
I was looking at "stress" more superficially... but I get your point and the link you make vis-a-vie the cortisol levels.


Thanks for taking me deeper.



Brian T Fick DDS
First Choice Dental Group
Partner / TMD Facial Pain 
621 South Park St.
Madison Wi. 
53715



On Jul 2, 2015, at 9:00 AM, Tom Colquitt < tcas...@gmail.com> wrote:

Looking at the big picture of stress--  are we talking about getting  divorce, getting  call from the IRS,losing our job, just watching the news.... all causes of exogenous stress?

Or of lack of ans coherence/homeostsis by endogenous stress related to inefficient breathing?  Hans Selye identified stress as a common factor in disease processes by discovering through bloodwork that the common denominator in chronic disease processes was the release of cortisol.  Cortisol is a stress hormone tht results in packing on belly fat despite the diet.  Hence part of the problem resulting in the high percentage of OSA patients who are obese and vice versa.  And in my opinion, one of the reasons obese patients with OSA, for whom we know every 10 pounds lost results in a diminution of the AHI, even though they may be managed 4 to 8 hours a night with CPAP or oral appliances...  STILL can't manage to lose the weight due to the other 16-20 hours a day they continue to release cortisol due to their dysfunctional breathing.  They clench and brux to keep their airways open due to the release of catecholamines when NONE should be released and continue to release cortisol with its damaging sequelae.

So, yes, in the big picture, bruxism is related to stress.

t. colquitt


On Thu, Jul 2, 2015 at 8:27 AM, Brian T Fick <brian...@me.com> wrote:
Doesn't the ADA keep up on current research? Aren't we long past this idea of bruxism being caused by stress!

The below explanation seems like a vast vast oversimplification

Correct?

From the ADA.

WJXT-TV Jacksonville, FL (7/2) reports that University of Florida researchers have created "a smart mouth guard equipped with sensors that allow it to detect" if a patient is grinding their teeth and relay information about the grinding to a dentist. Lead researcher and associate professor Yong-Kyu "YK" Yoon "said he came up with the idea about five years ago when he was developing a set of dentures that alert the dentist to an improper fit even if the patient doesn't complain about it." Fellow researcher and associate professor at the University of Florida Restorative Dental Sciences Department Fong Wong "said at least 20 percent of the U.S. population – about 30 million people – suffer from bruxism, which frequently is caused by stress and can lead to damaged teeth, headaches, insomnia, and a sore jaw.







Brian T Fick DDS
First Choice Dental Group
Partner / TMD Facial Pain 
621 South Park St.
Madison Wi. 
53715
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Digest for rec.food.cooking@googlegroups.com - 25 updates in 11 topics

Comments (0) |

"Ophelia" <OphElsinore@gmail.com>: Jul 03 02:23PM +0100

"Gary" <g.majors@att.net> wrote in message news:55967387.A3933B17@att.net...
> free version (with ads) to use and try. If you like it, pay for it to
> eliminate the ads.
 
> I still use good ol' Netscape 4.7 for usenet.
 
Eudora! Oh my, that is a blast from the past:))
 
 
--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk/shop/
notbob <notbob@nothome.com>: Jul 03 02:46PM


> What email client are you using on the ipad? Or are you using Web-based
> email?
 
Pretty much all contemporary email is "web-based". Some, like POP3
and IMAP, are merely "store-and-forward" systems, which allow one to
dwnld emails from web-based MTA's to the user's host clients (MSA/MUA)
using SMTP. Usually, most ISPs provide an MTA and a method of
accessing it directly from the web via an ISP website. Mine
does, though it does not allow me full admin access/control to my own
accts, as some other ISPs have.
 
nb
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au>: Jul 04 01:02AM +1000

On 4/07/2015 12:19 AM, pltrgyst wrote:
 
> The provided email client's folder management leaves infinitely much to
> be desired...
 
> -- Larry
 
On the iPad, I use the inbuilt email client. It is good enough for that
purpose. Occasionally I use webmail to check my main mail accounts but I
rarely do that when on the move. When I am using the iPad, I am
generally on the move and don't fuss so much with email. For usenet,
when on the move, I use NewsTap.
 
--
 
Xeno
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au>: Jul 04 01:03AM +1000

On 4/07/2015 12:24 AM, Gary wrote:
> upgrade though, I can do some things with it that I can't with the
> older one but it takes forever just to check my bank balance.
 
> G.
 
Add RAM, get rid of crap on it. Make sure you have no toolbars and other
sneaky added on crap.
 
--
 
Xeno
Gary <g.majors@att.net>: Jul 03 11:06AM -0400

pltrgyst wrote:
> >> time?
 
> > That would be BASIC on a Commodore 64.
 
> Ummm, Basic isn't an operating system
 
The language Basic isn't an op system but the commodore computers used
their own op systems and named them, "Commodore Basic Operating
System"
 
 
 
> Anyone who had to use Commodore's 300 baud modem, and set that baud rate
> using a potentiometer, because they were too cheap to use a crystal.
 
Ummm....what? I used and still have the 300 baud modem. I used it to
access Compuserve for a short time (it was worthless). Mainly, I used
it to access my college's mainframe computer from home...it turned my
home computer into a dumb terminal, just like I was sitting in the
computer lab. I could do my computer class homework from home, then
right before going to class, I could send it to the printer and it was
waiting for me when I got there.
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au>: Jul 04 01:08AM +1000

On 4/07/2015 12:29 AM, pltrgyst wrote:
 
>> For one, I keep my email account separate from my usenet. Saves
>> embarassing stuff ups.
 
> You can do that with T-bird.
 
Yes but I prefer to keep them totally separate.
 
>> The other is that T-Bird is cross platform, Agent is not.
 
> That's my argument, not yours. 8;)
 
Agent is used for my main email account. Every other account bar the
xeno one is rarely used. I use T-Bird for usenet and mail on the xeno
account.
>> is the best email client out there. I used to use it for usenet as well
>> but no longer. Keep the two worlds separate.
 
> So have I -- even used Agent's mail servers for many years.
 
Is your serial number <10k??
 
> The only irritants that I find in T-bird are due to small differences in
> the user interface on various platforms, but I suppose that unavoidable.
 
That's because the UI varies. Can't blame T-Bird for that... ;-)
 
--
 
Xeno
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au>: Jul 04 01:12AM +1000

On 4/07/2015 12:46 AM, notbob wrote:
 
>> What email client are you using on the ipad? Or are you using Web-based
>> email?
 
> Pretty much all contemporary email is "web-based".
 
Only if you set one up and use it. My email accounts are based with my
provider (Optus) and I use an email client for most access. Optus also
offers web access and I use that when I am away from my email clients
but this is not a regular occurrence.
 
> does, though it does not allow me full admin access/control to my own
> accts, as some other ISPs have.
 
> nb
 
I like my email downloaded on my computer. I have stored, and backed up,
my emails going back to my earliest days using Agent - which would be
nigh on 20 years now.
 
--
 
Xeno
"Nunya Bidnits" <nunyabidnits@eternal-september.invalid>: Jul 03 10:11AM -0500

"Brooklyn1" wrote in message
news:an2dpa1noa8g9nge1mmfonpehkcest5f2o@4ax.com...
 
>most foodborn illnesses are contracted
>from salad bars.
 
And here everyone thought it was bacteria. Thanks, Sheldon, for
clearing that up! You should write a book!
"Ophelia" <OphElsinore@gmail.com>: Jul 03 03:44PM +0100

<lucretiaborgia@fl.it> wrote in message
news:r5scpadc20a54d7cber0al9o2muc3k23b8@4ax.com...
>>of a heatwave so it is salads for us atm:)
 
> I heard all about the travails on BBC - I phoned my aunt yesterday and
> she said they could hardly breathe it was so hot.
 
We were in Northallerton yesterday and it was 38c!!
--
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"Ophelia" <OphElsinore@gmail.com>: Jul 03 03:46PM +0100

"Bruce" <Bruce@Bruce.invalid> wrote in message
news:mbscpalf6l6m1qb1tne9r55f8mjhpo82o6@4ax.com...
 
>>I heard all about the travails on BBC - I phoned my aunt yesterday and
>>she said they could hardly breathe it was so hot.
 
> Does that mean it's over 20 degrees?
 
28c here last night:( 38c in Northallerton yesterday lunch time!
 
Cheeky!
 
--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk/shop/
"Ophelia" <OphElsinore@gmail.com>: Jul 03 03:49PM +0100

"Gary" <g.majors@att.net> wrote in message news:559676A2.AD394FA3@att.net...
> been up to 115F. Not fun. And I work out in that heat some days.
> Believe me, the AC comes on when I get home. Ferret likes that part
> too.
 
It all depends on what you are used to. I have lived in hot climates and
you do get acclimatized. At home in Scotland, 18c is hot:))
 
--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk/shop/
"Nunya Bidnits" <nunyabidnits@eternal-september.invalid>: Jul 03 10:08AM -0500

"Brooklyn1" wrote in message
news:9f0dpa59nqutfjg9f0d899201fr0r03uc2@4ax.com...
 
 
>all I see
>is a list of ingredients and some preparation instructions, and
>several sentence fragments.
 
What you see is caused by a bad case of bowel optate... aka a
shitty outlook.
Gary <g.majors@att.net>: Jul 03 10:56AM -0400

Dave Smith wrote:
 
> As it turned out, we had spent more time
> downtown in her city that she had, been to the galleries, museum and
> theatre more than she had.
 
And going to galleries, museum and theatre doesn't make you special.
It's just what some people like to do. I dislike the ppl that think
that makes them feel superior.
 
PBS is a dead animal now. The other channels have taken over all the
good stuff.
"Nunya Bidnits" <nunyabidnits@eternal-september.invalid>: Jul 03 09:53AM -0500

wrote in message
news:qdfcpa9go9sq9chb52jd22ckfqan9ou4qb@4ax.com...
 
>>description of
>>anyone who thinks that Cool Whip is decent food.
 
 
>Are you calling me a piece of trash you low life?
 
His penchant for unbelievably stupid ad hominems is the main
reason he has zero credibility here.
Dave Smith <adavid.smith@sympatico.ca>: Jul 03 10:14AM -0400

On 2015-07-02 10:23 PM, DreadfulBitch wrote:
 
> We also have a lot of cottage cheese. Cottage cheese in the center of a
> slice of cantaloupe is wonderful! For a refreshing dessert a scoop of
> vanilla ice cream in the hollow of a cantaloupe is awesome!
 
 
My mother used to serve cold salad plates like that. We would have some
cottage cheese, some salmon or tuna salad, cucumber, tomatoes and fruit.
 
However, Julie will come up with excuses for why she can't serve that to
her herd.
Gary <g.majors@att.net>: Jul 03 10:51AM -0400

jmcquown wrote:
> >> greasy.
 
> It's entirely possible she has never had ribs. However, ribs don't have
> to be messy.
 
Oh yes they do! Eating proper ribs will have the sauce all over your
face from eyebrows down to chin. Finger licking good.
 
You dive into a huge plate of ribs, carry a roll of paper towels with
you.
 
G.
"Nunya Bidnits" <nunyabidnits@eternal-september.invalid>: Jul 03 09:45AM -0500

"koko" wrote in message
news:75nbpa92e28ip0a5b574vdad15at5tscun@4ax.com...
 
On Wed, 1 Jul 2015 16:19:35 -0500, "Nunya Bidnits"
>at the Great Lenexa Barbecue Battle against a field of 183
>competitors, I am going to share a little bit of technique. No,
>I'm not telling you everything, not even close.
 
snippage
 
>today.
>Thanks for sharing.
 
>koko
 
Thanks! As I mentioned upthread I didn't really specify in the
OP but this method is intended for chicken pieces, (thighs) but
it's adaptable to split birds, split breasts, quarters, etc.
 
MartyB
Ed Pawlowski <esp@snet.net>: Jul 03 09:56AM -0400

On 7/3/2015 1:28 AM, Julie Bove wrote:
 
>>> Jill
 
>> I bet you could do that - if you wanted to. It certainly isn't illegal.
 
> It is pretty disgusting though.
 
 
Not if done right. Just like composting. It will be odor free.
lucretiaborgia@fl.it: Jul 03 10:20AM -0300


>>I heard all about the travails on BBC - I phoned my aunt yesterday and
>>she said they could hardly breathe it was so hot.
 
>Does that mean it's over 20 degrees?
 
To a couple in their 90s, no longer used to blasts of heat, it is very
difficult.
 
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lucretiaborgia@fl.it: Jul 03 10:22AM -0300

>eliminate the ads.
 
>I still use good ol' Netscape 4.7 for usenet.
 
>G.
 
I am still using Outlook at this point - used to use Netscape light
years ago for usenet then AOL or MS bought it and it nose dived, so
switched to Agent.
 
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lucretiaborgia@fl.it: Jul 03 10:26AM -0300

On Fri, 3 Jul 2015 07:18:54 -0500, MaryL <stancole1@invalid.yahoo.com>
wrote:
 
>8.1, so I don't know how it works with them. But I *can* guarantee that
>there's no way to "pay for it" today.
 
>MaryL
 
That sorts that out, when I read Eudora I wondered. Thnx.
 
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lucretiaborgia@fl.it: Jul 03 10:27AM -0300

>>minutes. Rather quick! ;-)
 
>>It really is no biggie to do this.
 
>But why bother? It's simpler to buy a PC. And probably cheaper too.
 
Not probably, certainly !
 
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"Ophelia" <OphElsinore@gmail.com>: Jul 03 11:35AM +0100

"S Viemeister" <firstname@lastname.oc.ku> wrote in message
news:cvn66oFsbj0U1@mid.individual.net...
>>> washboard...
 
>> For old scrubbers? ;-)
 
> <splutter>
 
:-0
 
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Gary <g.majors@att.net>: Jul 03 07:41AM -0400

The Cook wrote:
 
> You always freeze them. Chop them and put the in useful sized
> baggies. Very nice to have next winter.
 
I do the same with fresh sweet corn. I husk them, chop off all the
kernels with my chef's knife then bag them one ear's worth at a time
in fold-lock bags. Roll them up, lick the end and fold over to stick.
Just like we rolled up an ounce of pot in the old days. Freeze them
for up to 6 months. They taste just like when you bought them months
before. No need to blanch first.
 
On sale here this week.... 5 ears for $1.00. I should have bought some
this morning but just didn't feel like dealing with them today. The
processing is a pita to me but so worth it when you eat some months
down the road.
 
G.
Brooklyn1 <gravesend10@verizon.net>: Jul 03 07:45AM -0400

"Julie Bove" wrote:
>Target. So far more than I need for my gazpacho. I don't want to make
>poppers. What else can I do with them? Might need to add something to my
>Amazon order. Can they be made into a dip of some sort? Thanks.
 
Pickled Peckers:
http://www.theyummylife.com/Pickled_Jalapeno_Peppers
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